A letter written to my friend that I felt was worthy of sharing to the world as well:
Now brace yourself for the rest since you asked!
Interestingly, about this time last year we made a decision to pull out of church-church. It’s a long story and had nothing to do with personality conflicts or even really theology, but it started with the fact that we could not find in the Bible any justification for Christmas and Easter but instead only proof that they were both pagan rituals brought into the church. When this was brought up it was immediately shut down. It started to make us really wonder because those outside of the church also shut us down in the same way. So it was observed that the unbelievers and the church were in agreement that Christmas and Easter were a good thing – and this is highly troubling if you think about it because the world should be pretty much against all things Christian (except for our good works). Satan is the prince of this world. So why was Satan’s folks and the church in full agreement about Easter? Even though perfect historical facts prove them to be based in paganism? So that was the start of my questioning about the church-church.
For me, on a personal level, and at every church I’ve attended I’ve been quite troubled by the following:
- existence of known and habitual sinning within the body of Christ (without rebuke or correction and ultimately excommunication – which is a clear directive in the Bible)
- a very serious lack of Bible understanding individually
- programmatic rituals which are not bad by themselves but when coupled with the above provide a perfect framework to spiritual death within the church (a feeling of godliness without the power)
- the fact that churches meet in buildings called ‘churches’ and people, especially Koreans, will say ‘Do you go to church?” which has an implied meaning of ‘Do you believe that Jesus is Lord and have you received him as your Savior and live your life for Him?” the two questions of which – as you well know – often have no correlation within the church-church
- the fact that ‘churches’ provide all their financial data, and the data of their members directly to the tax authorities strictly for a worldly benefit (tax numbers and tax benefits). See this post here as well about that.
- the bizarre reality of how people will drive all over their city commuting to ‘churches’ when their own backyards are spiritual graveyards and are ripe for the meeting of the believers together
- and more
In addition to the above challenges with the church-system, I have also personally and very deeply struggled with the lack of teachings about and help towards those struggling with (and yes these are all biblical sins) the following sins:
And you can run a few quick tests to confirm:
1. When was the last time you heard a preacher educating about how the sin of homosexuality works (spiritually) and how we are supposed to help homosexuals? Have you ever heard a preacher preaching about how we should reach out to these lost and hurting children of God?
2. When have you heard anyone preaching to/teaching a pre-married couple about the need to abstain from sexual interactions until the covenant is legal? Have you ever heard them preach/teach that perhaps it’s not even wise to do the worldly version of dating?
3. When have you heard anyone try to stop someone in their congregation from divorcing? Although I haven’t heard of it I’m sure there is a good chance this occurs regularly, but, when have you ever heard of a pastor boldly trying to stop them from committing adultery by re-marrying? Not ever once have I heard of a pastor doing this yet Jesus Himself said this:
Every one who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries a woman divorced from her husband commits adultery Luke 16:18).
4. When has anyone preached about how to help a pornography-addict, set up a course, etc? Or have they just preached empty statistics about how many Christians are addicted to it?
You see? A form of godliness without the power. This was a big part of my struggle and even began to seriously bother my conscience as God opened my eyes.
A religious ritual void of the life-changing power of the Spirit is what I was seeing in so many traditional congregations around me.
In summary – a massive hypocritical lifestyle that stinks in the sight of God.
And that is just a piece of my spiritual situation.
There is another challenge I have with the church-church and that is that the pastors are doing the five-fold ministry by themselves. We have pastors who are supposed to shepherd the flock, but where are the apostles, the prophets and the evangelists?
And the proof of something being amiss in the way it’s going for the poor pastors around town is that pretty much every pastor I know is either stressed, sick, having marriage and family problems or all of the above. Seriously. I joke not. Yes, I’ve heard the argument that Satan is attacking them more, but I’ve started to shy away from that one over the last few years, although I don’t deny that Satan hates pastors.
The great news is that after pulling myself and the family out of the church-church for a while, and dedicating that time to home Bible studies with other couples and families and our kids, things massively started to change including, but not limited to:
- a greater hunger for the Word of God
- a greater hunger for and revelation of truth in general (ie. Christmas, Easter, flat earth versus globe earth, evolution vs creation, satanic influence in the school system, etc, etc, etc).
- a much better understanding of the world around me such as world events
- a much closer relationship with my direct family
- an improved relationship with the unsaved members of my family and their circle
- an increased excitement towards the things of God including holiness, righteousness, wisdom, hard work, diligence, etc, etc)
- an increased confidence that God is with us individually, inside of us
- an increased confidence that God is capable Himself, without the church-church to sustain our very life and stamp His seal of approval on me directly with His Spirit
- an increased hunger to find others who are like-minded and hungry for God
- an increased intimacy with the brothers and sisters we have found who love the Lord in a similar way
- an increased desire to do the will of God instead of my own will or the will of others around me
- more of God, less of us.
In short, we have been transformed through the experience.
We are daily seeking to build the small fellowship we have but we are not willing to compromise on the above for the vain benefit of telling someone which authorized church-church we are part of. We find no basis in the Bible for this and so we are not going down that road again.
However, don’t misunderstand and think that we are ‘outside of the church’. It’s quite the opposite. We ARE the church now. We are actually doing the stuff we see in the Bible and God is bringing (quite quickly) other believers around to share this with.
And hopefully something here was encouraging to your faith.
I expect that God will do a mighty thing in your life and the life of your new wife.
Be strong in the Lord and faint not.
Seek the Lord and ye shall find Him. Knock and the door shall be opened.
Blessings to you, brother!
Let us continue our journey towards truth – whether hard or easy.
Did Jesus clearly ‘know about time zones’ and ‘talk about time zones’? Let’s take a look at the Bible in Matthew 24:36-42 and Luke 17:33-36 (pasted at the bottom for your convenience):
The argument against the flat earth model with these scriptures is that Jesus is ‘clearly talking about time zones’ which therefore implies that Jesus knew about time zones and therefore was heliocentric in his cosmology (that was a partial joke). I believe this argument is very weak and assumes on scripture that isn’t there because Jesus did not say ‘time zones’ or refer to them at all. The bullet points of what he is saying in these scriptures are:
- some people will be in the middle of what they are doing (sleeping, working, whatever) when it happens
- it is a unified event at one point in time
- no one knows the day or the hour
- In Matthew it doesn’t specify daylight or dark hours but calls it ‘day’ which has both light and dark hours in a 24 hour day
- In Luke it specifies both day (Luke 17:30) and then a few verses later night (verse 34)
Instead of assuming that God is talking about a globe earth time zone it would be better to assume only what is written which is that the coming of Jesus will occur while people are going about their daily lives.
In addition, when these scriptures were presented to a few people unbiased on the helio/geocentric models) around me as ‘proof for a time zone globe earth’ they immediately said “Well how do they know that the women aren’t grinding at the mill on a night shift?”
The answer is ‘we don’t’ and ‘they could have been’.
Because Jesus isn’t focused on cosmology in these scriptures but instead warning us to be ready wherever we are and in the middle of whatever we are doing.
Plus, these scriptures work just fine on both a globe earth and a flat earth model. In the globe earth it’s a time zone but on the flat earth the sun has simply moved away so it’s dark on one part and light on the other.
36 But of that day and hour knoweth no [man], no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only. 37 But as the days of Noe [were], so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, 39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 41 Two [women shall be] grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.
Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it. 34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two [men] in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. 35 Two [women] shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 36 Two [men] shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
I realized years ago that believers live in a very imperfect world. We are fish swimming upstream and there is nothing that the enemy of our soul would love more than to keep us weak and ignorant of God’s holy Word.
I knew that I had to find some form of ‘structure’ around my daily Bible reading. I found that I would get on a spiritual tangent and spend all my time in Proverbs, or shift over to Psalms, or again to the book of Acts for fun and adventure. But if you asked me who Habakkuk was I’d say “Habak who?” Since I knew that every word in the Bible is inspired something had to change.
I then tried a straight read through the Bible for X amount of minutes per day. The problem was that life would happen and I’d lose track and such. I needed something with a bit of ‘drive’ behind it. Something that would push against the desire of my flesh to stop. That’s when I heard about ‘Bible in a year’ idea. The idea is that the whole Bible is divided into daily reading segments so that the whole Bible is consumed in a calendar year. Genius! And so I began.
I spent time on Odb.org and simply clicked their daily Bible reading link but recently I discovered that it was linking to a Bible company whose ethics I can no longer suffer. So last week I disconnected myself from Biblegateway.com since its owned by the questionable company Zondervan.
The only problem was that now I had to search for another website that I could go to that would allow me to check to see where I was at and where I should be at. I found most of the websites either linked to Zondervan, or, didn’t have the audio Bible option (which I like). Most were just a list of 365 days and you had to figure out what day you were on today. Too hard for me.
Thankfully I found this website which appears to have solved my problem. It’s the International Bible Society’s site and although their website defaults to the NIV version (shame on them) at least it has all the features I need and doesn’t send traffic to Zondervan’s site.
I also understand that this great website has a pretty impossible-to-remember URL for people who want to actually go their daily so I made a permanent page here at W.O.T. for you to remember more easily:
This turned out to be *even better* than the program I was on because it also breaks out Psalms and Proverbs into their own daily chunks which is just awesome. Truly Psalms and Proverbs need to be consumed daily and it looks like this program does it. Here is a quick tutorial to set yourself up and navigate the tools:
Also, it is helpful to note that you should right click (or whatever the option is on your device) and ‘open in new tab’ when you click the Bible links because for some reason it doesn’t open a new tab/window automatically.
Although there is an option to change your start date, you may want to consider just starting today and leave it as January 1st. It is useful, I find, to have January 1st always as the start date. I don’t have a lot of explanation as to why but I just find it helps keep momentum.
Finally, you may want to consider doing what I plan which is to drop where I am in my current plan and use this. Mine didn’t have the Psalms/Proverbs section so now everything is different from where I am. I think it’s very worth changing the plan to synchronize with this one.
Question for you disciples of Jesus out there: What does Biblegateway.com, Zondervan, NIV, Gay Sex and Satan have in common?
As a recent website author I found this week noted, “Everything.”
After meeting Jesus and being born again, I was given an NIV Bible. For a few months I read it like any other Bible. Then someone introduced me to the King James Bible which, to me, was only of interest for it’s cool Ole English literary style. So I read that for a while. I strangely noted that the KJB was more ‘meaty and direct’ than the NIV. I couldn’t explain it other than ‘it felt more direct and more truthful’. So I just kept reading the KJB and never read the NIV again in my Bible time other than on a few occasions ‘just to test’.
Today, something uncool happened. For the last few years I have been a diligent promoter of the website Biblegateway.com. It is also linked daily to www.odb.org which is the publisher of Our Daily Bread Ministries. ODB might want to considering immediately un-linking. It’s perhaps a bit of a stretch but I just happened to find that Our Daily Bread and Zondervan are located just a 6 min drive from each other in Grand Rapids Michigan… coincidence? Hopefully….
Biblegateway used to be just a straight-up Bible website where you could go, read the Bible, and have the Bible played to you. Over the last couple of years, however, I started seeing a lot of advertisements for the NIV Bible on the side. Then, slowly, I noticed the appearance of more and more ‘flesh’. The girls in the banner ads started showing a bit more skin, my eyes started wandering a bit more until today when I was basically lusting after an ad of a woman lying on her back wearing nothing but a bikini-looking top with closed eyes and ‘inviting’ expression advertising some weird new age ‘floating’ activity.
On my daily Bible webpage???
Enough is enough.
It’s time to find out what’s up.
Immediately I did a whois lookup to find out who owns this website. Someone is starting to control me and I don’t like who they are. Check out these results as of today, August 13th, 2016. I give you the date because I would not be surprised if they immediately change the ‘ownership’ of the website after I finish this blog. The date is also in the screenshot:
I had remembered only one thing about Zondervan Corporation: they owned the NIV Bible which I had ‘funny feelings’ about. So I decided to do some quick searches and found this quick summary (pardon this person’s old-school web design and style and focus on the facts):
Shocking? It gets worse.
I decided to start looking at the actual scriptures and see how they compare. This page (same author) although it’s full of a lot of his/her anger, covers the details that you need to read. If anyone finds a better ‘snapshot web page’ of this KJV versus NIV, do let me know and I’ll update.
So, as you can see, Satan has definitely had his contributions to the writing of this ‘modern Bible’.
But, if that’s not enough for you, this next stuff really caught my attention. You see, a friend of mine has been teaching me ‘You have to always follow the money train, Wayne Out There.” He’s right. Whether it is a business, family, church, government, etc, you have to follow where the money train stops and you’ll note that many decisions – moral or immoral – about the world are made there. If you read from the link about the section under “The NIV and Zondervan” he writes the following points:
- Zondervan and NIV were purchased by HarperCollins
- HarperCollins publishes pro-homosexual books and the Satanic bible.
- HarperCollins is apparently a subsidiary of The News Corporation owned by Rupert Murdoch including Fox Broadcasting and a bunch of newspapers
Here is another link if you want to look more into the corporate stuff and the money train.
The conclusion is simple. You either support these people or you don’t. I don’t.
Today will be my last visit to my old favourite website Biblegateway.com.
Too bad you got in bed with the world.
Psalm 19, as follows and noted in this summary article is a very tough scripture to read and hold onto a globe earth model:
Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun, Which [is] as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber, [and] rejoiceth as a strong man to run a race. His going forth [is] from the end of the heaven, and his circuit unto the ends of it: and there is nothing hid from the heat thereof. (Psalm 19:4-6)
To begin the scripture we have a clear reference to the ‘end’ of the physical world. On a globe earth model, there are no ‘ends’ and you are supposed to be able to start at one point on the earth and complete a full circuit (circumnavigation). Since neither I, nor anyone I know, nor anyone they know has ever done this trip, I am unable to verify it first hand. Furthermore, it also requires faith that the globe earth map that we have been presented by popular sources, is in fact the truth. If you alter the map, you can alter your trips.
All I can be sure of, is that the Bible says here that the measuring line is able to reach the ‘ends of the world’ – a clear point of termination or a border/outskirt. Balls don’t have these.
The scriptures then go on to say that ‘in them’ He hath set a tabernacle for the sun. So, within the parameters of these borders of the earth, God has put in place a tent-like structure (“the heavens”?) in which the sun does its thing and moves. It seems that this tabernacle forms the limits to which the sun moves in. It does not say that it is flying through the limitless expanse of the vacuum of outer space, nor is there any reference to this that I can reasonably extract.
Next, the scriptures say:
Try as I might, but I am unable to interpret this scripture as anything other than:
- Heaven (the visible heavens) has an end/extremity
- The sun follows a circuit.
- The circuit mirrors the borders of the terminating edges of the heavens, or ends there and then loops back
- at some point during this circuit everything (that matters) is affected by the thermal heat
Edit 1: July 14, 2016: Added section ‘The Visible Second Coming of Christ” at bottom. Coming next: General biblical cosmology – What does the Bible say about the rest of the universe?
First Publication: July 2016
While I continue my journey down the flat earth versus globe earth investigation, it has become apparent a need to pull together a simple list of any scriptures in the Bible that seem to support a flat earth model and, should I find any, include those that support a globe earth model. To give credit where credit is due, many of the foundational scriptures of this post come from this video.
Why Bother Exploring This at All?
Truth. Does truth matter?
- Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth. (John 17:17)
- [He is] the Rock, his work [is] perfect: for all his ways [are] judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right [is] he. (Deuteronomy 32:4)
- For thy mercy [is] great unto the heavens, and thy truth unto the clouds. (Psalm 57:10)
- Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. (John 14:6)
- He that answereth a matter before he heareth [it], it [is] folly and shame unto him. (Proverbs 18:13)
- One witness shall not rise up against a man for any iniquity, or for any sin, in any sin that he sinneth: at the mouth of two witnesses, or at the mouth of three witnesses, shall the matter be established. (Deuteronomy 19:15)
- All scripture [is] given by inspiration of God, and [is] profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness (1 Timothy 3:16)
- God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged. (Romans 3:4)
The last scripture “Let God be true, but every man a liar” needs to be our modus operandi (M.O.) for receiving any information. This is the information generation and therefore the greater the need for better filters. One needs to take the position that every word of man is a lie and that every word from God is true. Assume the world is lying and be surprised when it is not. After all, Satan is the father of lies.
Let all men be liars. Let God be true.
Jesus is the way, the truth and the life.
If you love the truth and seek it, and filter everything through the assumption that everything you were ever taught other than God’s word may very well be giant pile of steaming something, then you are in a good position to find the truth and read your Bible in a new and exciting way!
The Implications – Why the Lie?
The very moment you start to explore even the possibility that the earth may be flat, you simultaneously must also ask yourself, “Self: why the lie?”
The Globe Earth Model Seems to Be a Direct Attack on God’s Word
Genesis shows that the earth was created first (1:1), then vegetation (1:11) and then, after the earth and vegetation were already there, God brings forth the sun and moon (1:14) – therefore members of mainstream modern ‘science’ present a direct and polar opposite attack on God’s word. This should come as no surprise because evolution, also presented by the same group, constitutes a direct attack on the very creation and image of man as the Lord says clearly that He made us in His image (1:26), not as a byproduct of random monkey business.
The Great Deception
Although there isn’t a lot of time to expound on this one, there are several scriptures in the Bible that seem to indicate that ‘space’ and ‘asteroids’ and ‘green aliens’ will form part of the end time shenanigans of the anti-Christ and the final deception. His ‘lying wonders’ will deceive even the elect and this never-preached, never-read and never discussed scripture has always seemed a little too close to the popular presentation of ‘aliens’ – which are clearly demonic in nature:
And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs [come] out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet. For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, [which] go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty. (Revelations 16:13-14)
Something is definitely ‘up’ with aliens and world-wide deception…
Money and Power
One simple thing that people forget is that organizations like NASA, and all those that are connected to it, make a lot of money. They literally suck the money out of taxpayer jeans without account. For what? A few rockets fired up every few years? Imagine if that money was dispersed to the needy of the earth for food, clean water, shelter and clothing? Instead there is a money train that needs to keep chugging along. And there are powerful people who want this globe earth model to continue. It helps the average person feel very small and powerless and for those on top, who know the truth, it helps them feel much more powerful than they really are.
Why this Matters
If the above didn’t, of its own accord, pull your heart strings and stir inside of you a certain feeling of a concern that you may be already be deeply deceived, and if you need further help seeing why this topic matters, we now present the following list of reasons:
- All of our astronomical teachings collapse
- Atheism collapses
- Humanism collapses
- NASA and space exploration collapse and therefore must be a scam
- Aliens (at least their origin and nature) collapse
- Airlines and telecoms must be involved
- Hollywood and popular music are involved
But God’s word remains.
O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane [and] vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called (1 Timothy 6:20)
Keep in mind as you explore this topic that a very large chunk of science is based on faith, not fact. A theory is just a theory. When ‘theory’ is taught as ‘fact’ we need to get very involved and concerned. Evolution is just such an example. And so it must be noted that scientists are not ‘unbelievers’ as they often claim. Instead, they absolutely believe – but just not the words of the Bible. They have faith in other things and other ways. They indeed have their own gods and faith.
Scientists also have a long history of lying to the world. Money always talks. If the margarine producers of the world need to sell more margarine, they will find the right scientists to find the right data to present to the world in the right way. Then when the butter producers realize their sales have plummeted because of this new and convenient ‘scientific data’ about margarine, they’ll go do the same.
Even though it may seem that I am 100% sold on the flat earth model, I am not yet fully there. I log this journey only so that I can be sure I’m properly thinking it through and leaving a record for others to follow. It is very inconvenient to try to explain all this when I meet people so I am hopeful that this post will be a good resource not only for myself but for others.
Consider a flat earth.
What you believe does matter.
I have included Strong’s definition links for words that seem most critical for this study. You can and should, of course, go and do your own research because let God be true and all men liars, remember.
- Fear before him, all the earth: the world also shall be stable, that it be not moved. (1 Chronicles 16:30)
- The LORD reigneth, he is clothed with majesty; the LORD is clothed with strength, [wherewith] he hath girded himself: the world also is stablished, that it cannot be moved. (Psalm 93:1)
- Say among the heathen [that] the LORD reigneth: the world also shall be established that it shall not be moved: he shall judge the people righteously. (Psalm 96:10)
Foundation/Foundations of the Earth
- And the channels of the sea appeared, the foundations of the world were discovered, at the rebuking of the LORD, at the blast of the breath of his nostrils.(2 Samuel 22:16)
- Then the channels of waters were seen, and the foundations of the world were discovered at thy rebuke, O LORD, at the blast of the breath of thy nostrils. (Psalms 18:15)
- Of old hast thou laid the foundation of the earth: and the heavens [are] the work of thy hands. (Psalm 102:25)
- When he prepared the heavens, I [was] there: when he set a compass upon the face of the depth: When he established the clouds above: when he strengthened the fountains of the deep: When he gave to the sea his decree, that the waters should not pass his commandment: when he appointed the foundations of the earth (Proverbs 8:27-29)
- Mine hand also hath laid the foundation of the earth, and my right hand hath spanned the heavens: [when] I call unto them, they stand up together. (Isaiah 48:13)
- Then the earth shook and trembled; the foundations of heaven moved and shook, because he was wroth. (2 Samuel 22:8)
- They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course. (Psalm 82:5)
- Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding. Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it? Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof; (Job 38:4-6)
- [Who] laid the foundations of the earth, [that] it should not be removed for ever. (Psalm 104:5)
- He raiseth up the poor out of the dust, [and] lifteth up the beggar from the dunghill, to set [them] among princes, and to make them inherit the throne of glory: for the pillars of the earth [are] the LORD’S, and he hath set the world upon them. (1 Samuel 2:8)
- Which shaketh the earth out of her place, and the pillars thereof tremble. (Job 9:6)
Four Corners of the Earth
- And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth. (Isaiah 11:12)
- Also, thou son of man, thus saith the Lord GOD unto the land of Israel; An end, the end is come upon the four corners of the land. (Ezekiel 7:2)
- And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree. (Revelation 7:1)
Ends of the Earth
- [Namely], of the gods of the people which [are] round about you, nigh unto thee, or far off from thee, from the [one] end of the earth even unto the [other] end of the earth (Deuteronomy 13:7)
Solid Dome Firmament Canopy
- And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. 7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which [were] under the firmament from the waters which [were] above the firmament: and it was so. 8 And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day. (Genesis 1:6-8)
- And above the firmament that [was] over their heads [was] the likeness of a throne, as the appearance of a sapphire stone: and upon the likeness of the throne [was] the likeness as the appearance of a man above upon it. (Ezekiel 1:26)
- Hast thou with him spread out the sky, [which is] strong, [and] as a molten looking glass? (Job 37:18)
- Then the earth shook and trembled; the foundations of heaven moved and shook, because he was wroth. (2 Samuel 22:8)
Sun and Moon Travel Around the Earth (geocentric)
- Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun, Which [is] as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber, [and] rejoiceth as a strong man to run a race. His going forth [is] from the end of the heaven, and his circuit unto the ends of it: and there is nothing hid from the heat thereof. (Psalm 19:4-6) (Read expanded comments on this scripture here)
- The sun also ariseth, and the sun goeth down, and hasteth to his place where he arose. (Ecclesiastes 1:5)
- Then spake Joshua to the LORD in the day when the LORD delivered up the Amorites before the children of Israel, and he said in the sight of Israel, Sun, stand thou still upon Gibeon; and thou, Moon, in the valley of Ajalon. And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. [Is] not this written in the book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day. (Joshua 10:12-13)
- The sun [and] moon stood still in their habitation: at the light of thine arrows they went, [and] at the shining of thy glittering spear. (Habakkuk 3:11)
Disc/Circle versus Globe/Ball
- Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun, Which [is] as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber, [and] rejoiceth as a strong man to run a race. His going forth [is] from the end of the heaven, and his circuit unto the ends of it: and there is nothing hid from the heat thereof. (Psalm 19:4-6)
- Thus [were] the visions of mine head in my bed; I saw, and behold a tree in the midst of the earth, and the height thereof [was] great. 11 The tree grew, and was strong, and the height thereof reached unto heaven, and the sight thereof to the end of all the earth: (Daniel 4:10-11)
- [It is] he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof [are] as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in (Isaiah 40:22)
- Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them (Matthew 4:8)
- To him that stretched out the earth above the waters: for his mercy [endureth] for ever. (Psalms 136:6)
- Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I [am] the LORD that maketh all [things]; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself (Isaiah 44:24)
The Visible Second Coming of Jesus
Before considering the flat earth model, I used to struggle with several scriptures that speak clearly of the second coming of Christ. When I read the Word of God it seemed clear that I, and all the inhabitants of the earth would see, with our own eyes, the return of Jesus. Yet, how is this possible if Jesus shows up in China and I’m on the top of the basketball in North America? I resolved that Jesus would have to rely on man’s technology (ie. TV, internet streaming, etc) in order for every eye to see… which never quite sat well with a mortal man such as I… The following scriptures either straight-up tell us that we will see Him with our eyes, or infer it:
- And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. (Acts 1:9-11)
- Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they [also] which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen. (Rev 1:7)
- For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. (Matthew 24:27)
- And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. (Matthew 24:30)
- Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven. (Matthew 26:64)
- And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory. And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven. (Mark 13-26-27)
- And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven. (Mark 14:62)
- Men’s hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken. 27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. (Luke 21: 26-27)
- For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive [and] remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. (1 Thessalonians 4:16-17)
I look forward to any comments, additions, revelations to add to this post.
There are many videos out there about whether or not the earth is flat or a globe. If you are a Bible believer, then you have a double duty of looking at this topic because, after all, the Bible is a flat earth book. Perhaps you glazed over the scriptures when you read them and filed them with ‘poetry’ or ‘simplistic teachings of science to an archaic world’. In either case, if you love the truth, you need to take a long hard look at this topic because it is absolutely important.
The implications of not looking at this could be tragic for you.
I found this video to be one of the best videos because it goes over many of the scientific issues but also incorporates all the scriptures so you can start a crash course on what the Bible says about the topic.
Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. – John 8:44
I used to ask questions in biology and geology classes in high school. I was shown the classic images about how we came from biological soup and ultimately evolved into humans.
Such imaginative stories!
But I had no other teachings about other theories. Nothing. I didn’t grow up with the creation story and I assumed that there was no chance that a public school would be allowed to teach lies because that would be unethical.
But I was wrong – very wrong.
A few years later someone explained the biblical story of creation which resonated so deeply in my soul as true that I could almost hear alarm bells ringing. However, I was already deeply mis-educated. I had already been brain-scummed (as opposed to brainwashed) with beefdirt (as opposed to hogwash) by the system. The two theories, neither of which have physical proof that can be put into a test tube, can co-exist. You cannot believe in one and believe the other. The creation explanation comes from a Book that says ‘every word in here is true’ so to believe that some story outside of the Book can explain our creation is impossible. Many well-meaning partial Bible believers have tried to mesh the two together only to be left with a watered down faith in the Book they claim to believe. They take the position that if something in the Bible doesn’t mesh with what they have been taught as truth in school that the Bible is an old piece of literature with a bit of poetry and room for interpretation. One gentleman, when I confronted him about his position of trying to believe both the Bible and evolution, proposed to me the idea that at the time of the Bible people were ‘more simple’ and so to teach these dense little archaic people about their origins, they had to ‘dumb it down a bit’. It had to be put into simple stories like the creation story in the Bible. You see, the people of that time were unable to understand ‘science’ and the very complicated idea that a monkey boy can become a human man if you just add enough zeros to the number of years it takes to do something like this…
Sorry, sometimes it just slips out…
The theory of evolution comes from unbelievers who say that we are meaningless dust floating in randomness heading nowhere fast and that God is just the by-product of humans evolving and becoming more self aware.
The two ideas are in stark contrast and cannot co-exist. But this makes sense because one is a lie and the other is true.
The truth will always resonate as true in your heart. But sometimes selfish forces will dominate our desire for truth. For example, you might be working for a big, stale operating system software company and someone approaches you and says “Your company is going down forever. They have failed to innovate. They are past the point of no return. They are doomed.” Deep in your heart, you know it’s true. You know all the competitors are better, cheaper, hipper, etc. But your job is so comfortable. Your life is so stable. You cannot believe this truth that the messenger is delivering. Your selfish voices of the flesh cry out against the truth and say “I will not believe it! If I do, I will have to change!” And you continue in your lie until you are ultimately faced with the thing you knew to be true when everyone gets their pink slips.
I recently posted this article that proposed the idea that the earth may in fact be flat. I was very intrigued by the reactions I would receive from people when I simply presented the idea. For a few months I was somewhat bothered by how people would begin (and usually end) the discussion with ridicule, but I am no longer bothered. In fact, I would be surprised if they did not react this way because most people are children of the father of lies – Satan. That’s right. I said it. I didn’t water it down. Most people are on the wide and easy path to eternal destruction. They refuse to follow the narrow path presented by Jesus which is the path of truth. Not that I have actually focused on this yet, but I don’t recall whether or not Jesus referenced the flat or globular earth in his earthly ministry, but if He did, it surely would have been rejected, because the recipients of His truth were of their father the devil and hated the truth. Think about it. He opened the blind eyes, healed the sick, cast out devils, raised the dead and to thank Him for these blessings in their community they tried to kill the guy he raised from the dead and then whipped him and stuck him on a cross to bleed to death.
People of the world hate the truth.
People of God love the truth.
There you have it. Simple.
Don’t be so frustrated any more when you find something that is true and people reject it. They have selfish reasons to reject it. They have much to lose in this world and by even considering most truths they are forced to take a long, hard look at their depleted and empty lives and feel the shakiness of the sandy foundation upon which they have built their lives.
The truth is painfully hard to bear. It always has been. It always will be.
And so it is via lies that Satan operates and keeps his children in full submission and obedience even unto death and eternal damnation. It is via strong lies that the anti-Christ will establish his throne in the earthly system as written in this letter to the saints (underline added):
Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things? And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time. For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth [will let], until he be taken out of the way. And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: [Even him], whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness. (2 Thessalonians 2: 5-12)
Yep, suck it up buttercup. Not only can you have the lies that you already believe in, but God is going to throw you a little cherry on top to make sure that your insatiable love for lies is satisfied at the Lie Buffet with a big ol’ rich piece of tiramisu lie cake.
So what is this strong delusion? The Bible predicts in no secret language that a strong deception will be set up for truth-haters to consume as a spiritual nail in their coffin. So what is on the menu? What lies have been perpetrated throughout the earth on a global scale which are in clear contrast with the God of the Bible? I believe there are three major ones and the last one only recently did I discover:
- Globular earth
As I continue to do my due diligence on the round/flat earth discussionN (I’m fairly new), it would seem shocking to me if the flat earth were *not* true based just on the following fundamental reasons:
- Every observation from my senses say ‘it’s flat’
- The Bible says it’s flat and the focal point of God’s creation
- There is incredibly strong opposition to the very discussion of it (much like the Creation story)
All three of these ideas/lies work in synergy.
All three of these work diligently to erode faith in the written word of God.
Observe the symbiosis:
-You cannot have aliens without space, planets, galaxies, NASA, etc
-You cannot (easily) have space, without the globular, heliocentric earth model
-You cannot explain our existence without evolution (or aliens), if you believe in the current heliocentric floating-through-random-space model
If you believe the Biblical creation story:
-You cannot believe in aliens if you believe in the creation story (there is no mention of any other life but ours)
-You cannot believe that we are randomly floating through space because uncountable scriptures show that the earth is a flat circle with foundations at the centre of all creation, with the sun and moon in motion over the earth, and with humans at the centre of the drama.
-You cannot believe in evolution while believing in the God of the Bible because God said He created it all with seeds already in each type of creation – a total contrast from survival of the fittest concept
And so I begin the journey for truth.
I love the truth far too much to simply join the masses for the sake of comfort.
I would rather be lonely in truth then with many people in deception.
Jesus is the Way, the Truth, and the Light/Life.
Join me in my pursuit of truth.
It has taken me about three months to put out this first post on this topic. It took about two of those three months to process the emotional elements associated with a paradigm shift and the remaining month to more positively embrace and learn about what originally seemed as an archaic and outlandish pile of beefdirt (slightly different from hogwash).
Before considering anything, I want you to first try an experiment. Regardless of what you believe about anything, I want you to approach someone, perhaps a teacher, a lawyer, or someone else of repute and simply make a statement. In order to get them to cooperate, I recommend prefacing the questions with something like this: “I wanted to get your feedback on a few people I know and their positions on things” The first survey question is this:
“Someone I know believes that earth is a kind of experiment and that aliens from another planet put us here. This guy basically believes in aliens. What do you think?”
Now, we are not looking here for their opinion, nor do we care about our own. What we are looking for is their *reaction*. Now it’s time for the second question to the same person:
“Someone else I know believes that there is a God. Like a real person who created the whole world. What do you think about this?”
Again, we don’t care about their opinion or ours, just their *reaction*. Finally, the third and final one:
“This other guy I know believes that the earth is flat and that everything we’ve been taught in our textbooks about the ‘ball earth’ may not be true.”
And note the reaction between all three.
It has been my experience that people will react politely and with respect to the first two. They may disagree, think they are ridiculous or like a fairy tail, but there still an element of respect in the way they communicate. However, what is most intriguing to me is that when someone is presented with the idea that the earth is flat, for some reason this one creates a very clear reaction. It goes like this:
1. Shocked Disbelief
In this first stage you typically hear things like “You’ve got to be joking, right?” and “You aren’t serious, are you?” and “HA, HA, HA!!!”
2. Insulting Ridicule
During this stage, and it comes right away, statements like “Did this person even go to elementary school?” and “Did this person die in the dark ages and wake up today?” or even things like “Does this person even have a brain?” The tone is often quite insulting and loaded with ridicule -akin perhaps to an adult who believes in Santa.
During this stage you will notice that people around the flat earther who is considering the idea that the earth might be flat will be treated as if they had just dropped a nasty fart. Slowly and politely people start separating from them and try to avoid being connected with this person. This person is now socially awkward. Keep in mind that green aliens were not…
Should the person who is considering the flat earth model make it through stages 1 to 3, the next stage is more challenging. Family, friends and anyone else in the tight circle will begin to get a bit angry. Without any in depth study of the model, they will make bold statements such as ‘You’re wrong” and “You need to drop this flat earth thing” and “You are crazy and I don’t want to talk about this any more” or “Seriously, WTF is wrong with you?” You know – angry statements.
So unlike the alien or deities, for some odd reason this topic shakes people up. It really gets to their core. It stirs something up inside of them that other discussion topics don’t. I was left to truly ponder this and think about why it was that such emotions and reactions were incited. In fact, it was these reactions that propelled me to study it beyond a surface glance.
Then I thought about 9/11.
The 9/11 incident used to be in a similar position. When Loose Change came out, it was highly unpopular to discuss the possibility that a power higher than the public authorities and governments may have been involved in the destruction of the buildings and the innocent lives on USA land. Yet after much investigation it is quite obvious that there is either ‘significant proof’ or ‘a strong reason to dispute the public report’. Yet, all of the above stages/reactions could be observed if one were to present such an unpopular idea.
Yet, many of the people I know who believe that 9/11 was an inside job still display the above stages towards me when I present the flat earth idea to them. Even though there is significant physical evidence to support the model, the reactions overpower the willingness to look.
So I was forced again to think about why the flat earth is even more unpopular than 9/11 as a inside job. I have now concluded that the reason is quite simple.
The Bible clearly preaches the flat earth model.
The world hates God, has an agenda against the Bible, and fights tooth and nail against all truth found therein.
Other such examples of faith-based emotion-stirring topics are:
- we evolved from monkeys randomly VS a loving God created us thoughtfully
- me and my interests are most important VS God and God’s interests are most important
- store up treasures in earth VS store up treasures in heaven
- if someone hits you, hit them back VS if someone hits you, turn and let them hit the other cheek, too
- if someone wrongs you, it’s ok to hate them VS forgive your enemy continually
- divorce is ok VS divorce is not ok
- abortion is ok VS abortion is not ok
- homosexuality is normal VS homosexuality is not normal
- we are specks of random dust, on a random ball, flying through space VS we are created beings, on a flat surface on the centre stage of everything God made for us
And so my conclusion is that in order for this topic to be so vehemently opposed, and with such gusto, there must be truly something here worth investigating further.
Stay tuned as I slowly explore this most interesting topic.
Joshua 13-21 is the part of the Bible where God divides the land to the 12 tribes. I have read this many times and it’s a little… boring. The Word of God ‘boring’??? Sin! Repent!
No. Some parts of the Word of God are boring. Of course they are “exciting because it’s the Word of God and God is speaking to you”, but… the content (of some parts) is boring to me. It’s important, but it’s boring. Like, who wants to read about borders and city names, especially when the map is totally different today? It’s like how music theory or in-class driving classes are boring and jamming out and driving fast is more fun or… ANYWAY!
I love the Bible and great news! I found a really cool link to make chapters Joshua 13-21 *way more fun*. Check this map out, zoom in on the details and try to find all the places on this map as you read your Bible. It’s in Spanish or some etymologically-similar language that I don’t know but the names are pretty close. And I really love this map because somebody made it *by hand*! Someone must have really loved their Bible and/or found it too boring to read these sections without the visuals. Someone dedicated a *big* part of their life to making *our* Bible time more fun so I’m super thankful: